Adam and Eve never existed, or so some evangelical intellectuals now believe. Really? Must we hang on to these stories as literal truth? But without Adam and Eve (and the story of original sin) is there the need for a Savior? Thinking through this one: story
"But if the parts of Scripture that you are claiming to be false, in effect, are responsible for creating the fundamental doctrines of the Christian faith, then you've got a problem," Rana says.
ReplyDeleteThis is interesting to me because I'm very comfortable with parts of the Bible being only morality tales. However, where do you draw the line? If Adam wasn't real, was Jesus? If Paul's commentary on women was just cultural, what about what he had to say on homosexuality? There are serious implications when the Bible is viewed even in part as allegory.
Adam and Eve as allegory doesn't change the idea of sin and separation from God for me. Perhaps they were just an illustration of the separation from God we feel because of being human.
More on Adam: http://biologos.org/questions/death-before-the-fall
ReplyDeleteUnderstanding the Adam and Eve story as a real historical narrative is a non-starter for me. It is not historical fact, was never meant to be, and was never understood as such by the people who wrote it or read it when it was written. The first two chapters of Genesis (which contain two distinct creation stories) were written in the 6th Century BC when Israel was in captivity in Babylon. They are not historical statements, but theological affirmations made by the people of Israel for the people in Israel. The stories say that although the people of Israel are enslaved, it is THEIR God that created and rules the world (not a pagan god such as whoever the Babylonians were worshiping). This is a theme throughout the OT. Israel tell stories like this for hope and encouragement and in order that it might keep its identity in a foreign land. The other half of the God-rules-the-world theme is that the God of Israel will redeem his people and deliver them from exile/captivity. Both halves of this theme are all throughout the OT - Pentateuch, Psalms, prophets.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Clint, in that, I can feel comfortable to believe the Adam and Eve story is a narrative along with others in the Bible. Like Christina said though, where do we draw that line? What do we pick as literal and figurative...or does it matter? I think it matters, but perhaps I'm missing the point and it doesn't as much.
ReplyDeleteThere is so much I want to write in response to these comments; it's hard to be brief.
ReplyDelete1. Jen, welcome to the blog!
2. I think if we read a Bible story and start our analysis with a question like - "is this story true" or "what does this mean to me" or "did this literally happen" - we're very quickly off to bad start that will probably prevent us from being able to answer those very questions. When reading the entire Bible, not just the OT, I think the better questions to start off with are always - "what's going on here" and "who is telling this story and why" and "what is this author trying to say" and "what is happening in the life and time of Israel/Rome/Babylon/etc. that make the telling of this story important enough to be told and told in this particular way." After we ask and try to answer these types of questions, I think answers to the first set of questions become more apparent.
3. When you use phrases like "where do we draw that line" and "what do we pick" I understand what you mean, but it makes it sound like: (1) literal stories are the ones that “count” and figurative ones should be avoided, and (2) that the distinctions between what is real and what is fiction is going to depend upon some arbitrary marker. First, I promise you that there is power and truth in figurative stories, especially when you couple them with the historical and cultural contexts in which the stories are told. Second, you may be thinking along the lines of - I'm comfortable "believing" that Jesus walked on water, but I can't accept that Joshua made the sun stand still. My short answer to the question of where do we draw the line is that you can’t draw a line. Some stories in the Bible are literal, some are figurative. You have to read each, study each, fit each into the context of the whole Bible and the themes and overarching story being told in the Bible to discover the difference. And you have to understand, especially with the OT, that these stories likely went through generations of retelling before they were written down. And they were written down for reasons like I listed above - for hope, encouragement, to illustrate the power of God. So, did the sun listen to Joshua's command and stand still? No. But does God rule the earth, including all of the nature that he created on this planet, and is God faithful to those who ask for his help and work through those who do his will? Yes.
ReplyDeleteAnd it does matter. It matters whether something is literal or figurative because if you can tell the difference that means you're studying the Bible and understanding how it works and what it means to say. And it matters - especially if you have doubts - because you will never get past them if you don't address this issue. Also, I would bet that the more these things bother you and the more you're willing to spend time studying them, the more you'll understand, and the deeper you'll grow in your faith. Or, you may arrive at a point where you understand the bible in a greater depth and you are confident enough to say that it’s not what you thought it was and there’s no way you could devote your life to becoming a part of the story it sets out. Either way, I’m certain that if you really put time into exploring the bible, you’ll find it to be a very different book than you knew it to be. It’s so much more than the Sunday school versions of the stories you (and I) read and learned as a child.
4. Maybe it would help if we started with the understanding that the Bible is NOT a historical book and its authors did not try to write such a book. If we try to make it as much, we’re essentially saying that God gave us the wrong book. What the Bible is, really, I think, is a collection of books that document the cultural and theological struggle of a people who lived in the world and believed in a God who rules the earth and upon whom they depended. It is a starting place for our own struggles in that same world.
5. Mentioned above, “doubt” is a great place to start to explore the Bible in more depth. In fact, if you’re finding yourself in doubt, I only see your options as (1) stay in doubt, (2) study and pray and try to figure out if your doubts can be overcome or if they're justified, or (3) give up. Only option #2 makes sense to me. And it’s exciting for me to think this group would pick that option because that’s where I’m at and it’d be fun to study and pray together because it’s more fun to share and could be lonely and frustrating to do it on your own.